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Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Dave
1/3/2006  3:51:00 AM
Phil. To me there is a slight difference between leg rise and body rise. With body rise(stetch) I feel that the floor is pushing my spin up while gravity is pushing everything else down, that is lighter than bone.
Some people will dance leg rise with little stretch of the body or even with a collapsed spine(shoulders pop up) Dave.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by phil.samways
1/3/2006  4:50:00 AM
I agree there is probably a subtle difference, but when i sat on a chair in my normal dancing posture, i couldn't get any body rise (maybe a teeny bit, which i'm sure nobody would see on the dance floor. I concluded that body rise must be leg rise - maybe leg AND foot rise,come to think of it, whereas foot rise is just foot rise
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Dave
1/3/2006  6:09:00 AM
Phil. When sitting in a chair you arn't swinging your whole body up against the force of gravity
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by phil.samways
1/3/2006  6:18:00 AM
That would be leg and foot rise.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Iluv2Dance
1/3/2006  8:02:00 AM
Hi,
The following brief explanation of Body Rise should prove of assistance in obtaining the correct physical performance of Rise and Fall of the body. This can be divided into three sections. (1) Correct carriage of the body and correct use of the legs. This is known as (1) Muscular Tension. (2) Use of the knees. (3) Use of the feet.
To achieve the correct muscular carriage, do the following. Stand in an erect position with the body muscles braced slightly upwards but not inwards. There should be no chest or shoulder lift. This covers the actual body or torso. To this we add the correct muscular tension of the legs from the feet upwards: Holding the body correctly, Rise on to the balls of both feet - known as Foot Rise. You should now have the feeling of ‘Standing Tall.' Now lower the heels still with that feeling of ‘Standing Tall.' The Use of the Knees: Now, with the body (Torso) and legs being used correctly, Rise and Fall may be achieved by bending and straightening the supporting knee or knees, with, or without, the use of Foot Rise. It could be correctly defined as Body Rise being the feeling of the whole body rising and lowering through the use of the knees. Rise and Fall in the original ballroom technique was covered only by the Footwork. If a step was written as Heel Toe (HT) it meant that the step had a rise. When the technique was re-written to become the ‘Revised Technique' the concept of Body Rise was introduced.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by suomynona
1/3/2006  9:06:00 AM
"Rise and Fall in the original ballroom technique was covered only by the Footwork. If a step was written as Heel Toe (HT) it meant that the step had a rise. When the technique was re-written to become the ‘Revised Technique' the concept of Body Rise was introduced."

This could be a contributing factor to why the specified rise and fall is not exactly the same as the desireable change in body altitude. The revision does not appear to have been complete enough to make the words mean what an inexperienced student would think they should, instead the book remains readable only by those with a knowledge of its language and usage.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by phil.samways
1/3/2006  9:34:00 AM
THere are very few text books written to cover all levels of expertise (think of Maths text books for 12-15 year olds, and those for university students - they'd be very different). The problem in dancing is that there simply aren't enough students (at all levels)to warrant writing diferent texts for different levels.
Hence, there is no substitute for a good teacher.
Interestingly, there are videos to cover different levels.
I'm philosophising again. you'll have to stop me!
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Napier
1/22/2008  9:14:00 AM
'Foot rise' is a rise resulting from raising oneself onto the balls of the feet. 'Leg rise' is a result a full or partial straightening of the leg when commencing from a compressed or (bent-leg) position. In theory it is possible to use either type of rise independently or to use both simultaneously, although typically throughout much of ballroom they are used together, which is one of the reasons it is difficult to understand them as separate topics.

As for 'body rise' it is a myth or at least a misnomer! And a nasty one that seems to confuse even many of the highest level professionals. Most teachers of any subject (dance included) are as mad as bloody hatters and think they are doing all sorts of things they aren't when they undertake whatever it is they are trying to teach you and that they AREN'T doing all sorts of things they clearly ARE if you watch them! As a student of anything, one needs to learn to filter the good advice they give you from their years of experience and expert ability from the nonsense they sprout out of tradition or confusion....not that that's always easy but total physical impossibility is always a good clue!!

'Body rise', if you interpret it literally CANNOT exist because, as you will soon notice if you stand in front of a mirror, it is impossible to lengthen the region of your spine from your coccyx to your skull short of lying down for 8 hours sleep (which apparently makes you grow about 1 cm or so, which gravity then robs back off you throughout the day as your spine recompresses), going into zero-gravity for a while (same principal) or perhaps the employment of some sort of medieval torture device such as the rack! The best you will manage, if you try, will be to shrug your shoulders (which is clearly not what is intended). Given the impracticalities of the formerly mentioned techniques during a bar of even the slowest foxtrot, then if you think logically about it, it can't have anything to do with your body or trunk as the name suggests.

Given that you can only rise using your feet or legs then, 'body rise' MUST be the employment of one or the other or both of these or else a complete figment of the imagination, perpetrated by generation after generation of dance instructor.

Alex Moore, in Moore (2005)* describes 'body rise' as a bracing of the leg muscles, in as much as I can gather, which, by no co-incidence, is exactly what ‘leg rise' is!!

Rises termed ‘Body rise', depending on whether taken on a heel turn or on a simple backwards walk must be ‘leg rise' or perhaps on the latter, a combination of ‘foot' and ‘leg rise' and if you examine dancers, this is indeed what they appear to be doing. I know it's what I do and what my teachers actually do, despite the fact that some of them keep insisting I should spontaneously add and retract a few centimetres from my spine as they believe they have the mysterious and magical ability to do. I would pay to see that! Some people may tense the muscles of their trunk or other muscles of their body as some people here have claimed….that's fine…if it works to put you in the right frame of mind, I would say, do it by all means, each to his/her own, but be aware, it won't make your spine any longer!!!!

Thus, ‘body rise' is a redundant term!!!

Q.E.D.

* Moore, A. (2005). Ballroom Dancing. A & C Black Publishers Ltd., London., pp 20-24.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by terence2
1/22/2008  11:43:00 PM
I think the literal translation of "BR" , can only be translated by the world of mystics !

The term was intended to show, that if the knees are flexed ( which they frequently are ) then the gradual straightening of that apendage should be absorbed in continuity, with the rise designated thru the feet .

Bad explanation = bad results .


But your point is well taken .
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Serendipidy
1/23/2008  4:40:00 AM
I don't think to use the words straightening of the legs as correct. Straightening of the knees yes. My legs are straight and dont need straightening. Its the knees that bend and straighten. The rise is through the feet and the knees as well as in the lowering.

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