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Re: If my maths are ok
Posted by Anonymous
12/23/2006  8:28:00 AM
" Exactly what are you on about. If it is backward steps for the lady there is no footrise."

Yes, that has been my position all along. Wheras you had to post, and then go back and repost, the following contradictory argument:

"To save you the trouble of looking for yourself I have done it for you.
This is where we do Not want no foot rise. we want foot rise.
This means we do not want to stay down. We want to come up. You idiot."

As for the timing, seeing as how you were one of those who messed up the waltz timing so badly, I suggest you leave the issue of foxtrot timing safely alone. Or take the advice Don said he was given - put the slows on the beat and don't worry about the quicks. That's pretty good advice, except that really to be univeral it should be restricted to the first quick only.
Re: If my maths are ok
Posted by Anonymous
12/23/2006  8:29:00 AM
Gosh, my fingers are betraying me!

The recommendation was of course to put the QUICKS on the beat and not worry about the SLOWS
Re: If my maths are ok
Posted by GuestAT
11/22/2006  9:44:00 AM
"That is lower at the end of STEP three, not the end of BEAT three."

I would argue the reverse. Waltz music has a strong first beat and kind of a softer 2nd and 3rd beat. Lowering at the end of the 3rd beat into beat 1 would create a motion that would correspond with the expression of the music.

"Even if you make the assumption that each step takes exactly one beat, there is absolutely zero evidence to suggest that beats align with steps. In fact, there is a lot of evidence to suggest that steps begin and end somewhere around halfway through each beat - that would put the weight change which is approximately the midway action of each step on the downbeat, and would have us counting steps in terms of beats as and-one, and-two, and-three."

If you're not dancing syncopated steps, each step (as it is planted) should be exactly on each beat. The transfering of weight is entirely a different matter. This all has to do with creating continuity/fluidity of movement.
Re: If my maths are ok
Posted by GuestAT
11/22/2006  10:06:00 AM
"I put the and count after beat three at the begining of STEP 1. If you wish step 1 to land squarely on beat 1, then the part of step 1 that takes place before the foot lands (which is about half of the step!) must take place before beat one... which is to say, during the later portion of beat three."
You could subdivide the beat down to whatever level you want. Whether it's 1, 2, 3. or 1 &, 2 &, 3 &. or 1 e & a, 2 e & a, 3 e & a. Your focus should be on when your step is considered to have been taken or when your foot is planted (not when to start to move your foot to take the step which I think is why the desciption for when to lower is vague or not excruciatingly precise) and that is right smack on the beat not on the 'e', the '&', or the 'a' of a beat. Otherwise, it would be dam near imposible to tell if you're dancing to the tempo of the music.

Re: If my maths are ok
Posted by GuestAT
11/22/2006  10:09:00 AM
"I put the and count after beat three at the begining of STEP 1. If you wish step 1 to land squarely on beat 1, then the part of step 1 that takes place before the foot lands (which is about half of the step!) must take place before beat one... which is to say, during the later portion of beat three."

You could subdivide the beat down to whatever level you want. Whether it's 1, 2, 3. or 1 &, 2 &, 3 &. or 1 e & a, 2 e & a, 3 e & a. Your focus should be on when your step is considered to have been taken or when your foot is planted (not when to start to move your foot to take the step which I think is why the desciption for when to lower is vague or not excruciatingly precise) and that is right smack on the beat not on the 'e', the '&', or the 'a' of a beat. Otherwise, it would be dam near imposible to tell if you're dancing to the tempo of the music.
Re: If my maths are ok
Posted by Anna
11/22/2006  3:59:00 PM
GuestAt. First there are dancers who have been criticised for dancing behind the beat. Dancing is an art. If you are at all musical you won't dance step one, dead on one, or two and so on. If a dancer arrives on what would appear early they can use the bending of the knee to absorbe some time. One pace or step is as the moving foot arrives under the body. So there is a distance to be travelled. The ladies leg is part of the way back on the count of three and. She is waiting for the man now to signal what length of pace he is going to take and she to respond. Then we have the other two beats and steps. They will differ from couple to couple. But if you are a member of a Formation team . What then. Everybody has to be spot on. More robotic.
Re: If my maths are ok
Posted by Anonymous
11/24/2006  9:33:00 PM
"Your focus should be on when your step is considered to have been taken or when your foot is planted (not when to start to move your foot to take the step which I think is why the desciption for when to lower is vague or not excruciatingly precise)"

The descriptions of rise and fall are relative to the official period of each step.

The officialy period of a step does not begin when the foot is planted! Instead, it begins when the moving foot passes the old standing foot, and ends when the other foot passes this new standing foor. Or for a closing step, when the foot is halfway closed.

If you aren't going to use those official defintiions, then you have to adjust the given rise and fall instructions to take into account the difference between the official definitions and the definitions in terms of which you do wish to speak.
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