Most rotation in closed position ballroom dancing is progressive. But progressive rotation doesn't necessarily preclude any other range of motion. There are only two things you can't do during progressive rotation: Stop moving, and stop turning. (Well, technically you can, but then it's no longer progressive rotation.

Ballroom dancing is entirely about moving through three basic ranges of motion (progression, rotation and swing/sway) in various combinations and speeds. At any given time you can have one, two, or all three. To say that only two can exist at once is silly.

The ultimate show of arrogance is to declare that just because you are incapable of doing something, it means it can't be done.

That's not to say that you should necessarily try it. Perhaps it's not for you. Pivot & Spin actions do not require sway; It is simply an option, and not one that you ever have to explore... especially if you lack the skill to pull it off.

Nonetheless, good dancers do it all the time, and they somehow manage to execute it with extreme grace and elegance. "Barbaric" is a reasonable word to describe what happens when an under-qualified dancer attempts it, but the same could be said of any movement. Even the most basic bronze sway-less Spin Turn can look "barbaric" if attempted by a beginner who is not familiar with the basic technique.

You certainly like to limit yourself. Then again, that may be exactly what you need to do at this point in your dancing, so it's not necessarily a bad thing. Just remember that not everybody requires such limitations as your own.

Turning locks can sway to the left OR right, can be ended in closed OR promenade position, and can be followed by just about anything. If you're into the whole 1994 thing, yes, a Running Weave or Quick Open Reverse to Tumble Turn is a lovely pattern to follow with. Tried and true. But it doesn't need to be followed by anything to be called a Turning Lock. The defining qualities are not what comes before or after, but what it is: A lock step that turns.

Regards,
Jonathan

The main point of this discusion is the Turning Lock following an Overturned Spin Turn to back the LOD. Not the one that follows a Spin Turn backing diagnal to the centre which we all know does not have Sway to the right. I might add that ordinary Lock Steps Quickstep or Waltz plus an Outside Spin has no Sway at all. Neither does a Double Reverse Spin. So who teaches a Sway to the right for a man on a Turning Lock backing LOD. It is not a Tipple Chasse which would Sway left anyway. It is interesting but the Turning Lock it is a deep cross and not the half hearted one we so often see. Main point. There should be no Sway to the right for a man on a Turning Lock that has an alignment of backing LOD. So i am told. This is the Internation Style of Ballroom Dancing. For the other styles i haven't a clue.

Hi Anna
It's interesting because we do a spin turn, back turning lock (backing LOD) opening out to promenade.
I've been told that 'no sway' is the English style. Correct and nice if done properly. Sway to the right is the 'italian' style. More volume, harder to do well, but more interesting.
We do the sway to the right version. I find it brings my body round, helping my partner move round me smoothly, and there is an 'over-the-top' feeling about opening in promenade, which is nice.
I have a habit of collapsing a bit to the right, instead of projecting myself up and out to sway. But i know about it, and i'm working on it.

Hi. Phil. This goes back to Harry Smith- Hamphire who i think quite rightly stated that. If we are going to allow changes to the technique. The books must be regulaly upgraded. If it isn't the different styles will become chaotic. It is the book that has kept the style on the straight and narrow all these years. The judges have a duty to, if they want to find a difference to mark between two couples , the one who is doing the correct technique should get the vote. And it does happen that way. Best wishes

Phil. When we do a normal Lock Step we stop Locking when our thighs meet. It is not a tight Lock. A Turning Lock is not a normal Lock Step. The foot goes past otherwise it is not a Lock that we turn on. If i swayed to the right as a man That crossing foot will not go into the correct position. If the Sway is first to the left and only to the right after the Lock. Then it does make some sense if it can be controlled. I was thinking twice about putting this in, but here goes.
This is how we are taught the Turning Lock finishing in Promemade.
At the end of the Spin Turn the man finishes facing against the LOD and holding that position extends his right leg behind without turning pointing the toe diagnal to the centre. From there it is a clean step straight into the Turning Lock. I wonder if i have written this so it is understandable. I think you will find that done this way the turning is over the Lock.

I have had a look at Marcus Hilton on
Ballroom Competition Figures 2. There is a Turning Lock in both Quickstep and Waltz. Neither of them have Sway to the right. The Sway to the right might be something that has crept in in recent years. And maybe it will go like that near splitz that an Italian introduced a year or two ago in the Tango.
On the Chasse Roll to the Right by Marcus Hilton there is just a slight sway to the left looking at the line of his shoulders. Some people might be excused from thinking that they are watching a Turning Lock, but as we know they start on different feet on beat one.

"Turning Lock in both Quickstep and Waltz. Neither of them have Sway to the right."

Two places to look for the sway:

1) As the man passes the lady during the second step of the spin turn action, you will usually see a sway to the right there, because he tends to SWING past her.

2) At the transition between the spin turn and turning lock. Many of the top English teachers refer to the proper body positions at this point as being a "mini oversway" And I use those quotation marks literally!

Incidentally, remember that the primary location of sway is in the HIPS. Inexperienced dancers often create it by collapsing their ribcage so that it shows up as an incline of the shoulders, but on experienced dancers it is in the hips. The shoulders may either incline with the hips, or remain more level than them, depending on preference. So just because you don't see an incline in the shoulders does not mean that there is no sway! Nor does seeing an incline in the shoulders on lower quality dancers necessarily mean that there is - you might simply be seeing broken sides.

Marcus Hilton would of course do the 'English version@ Nothing wrong with it - especially, as i said, when done very well, as of course it is in his case.
Anyone seen Gozzoli doing it? I must look.
Anonymous - wouldn't it be the case that, in a sway, the shoulders should be kept in the correct position relative to the top of the spine? This would mean they would slope slightly.
I agree about not collapsing. I owned up to this in my previous posting, but i'm working on it!! (it's just a habit picked up when i was learning )Extend up and project.....(don't hit the light fittings though)

We still come to what is Sway. Watching the fore mentioned tape. On step two of the Natural we have Sway definitely. The whole of the body is on an incline. Nobody would say that isn't Sway. Then on another step we have just the slightest incline one way or the other which can be seen at the shoulders level. Is that Sway. Compare the two on 4 5 of a Natural Spin Turn. Which is the one you can't possibly do. The one you can't possibly do is as step two of a Natural.
The point is. Don't think of a perfectly natural movement of the top line as being Sway. It is simply to get from one position to another. In other words we do what comes naturally. What we don't do is over emphasise, turning something that isn't a sway, and turning it into a mess. Mess meaning an out of balanced body or a misshaped ugly top line that will get you no marks. Does that make sense.
It might be worth taking a look at the Foxtrot video from last years Blackpool. Timothy Howson uses more sway than Mirko Gozzoli. Jonathon Crosssley on that Fallaway you will see a movement of the shoulders. What we can see up to the lead up is very subdued Sway. Chris Hawkins on his Wave has far less Sway than Timothy Howson. Keep an eye on those shoulders. In his swivell, nobody would call that Sway. I wonder what you misguided sway merchants would be doing

"I wonder what you misguided sway merchants would be doing"

Quickstep, you know your irresponsability with the facts is just atrocious.

For starters, you are ALL WRONG about Hilton's use of sway. I'm looking at Marcus Hilton on a superstars video, where he does a spin turn and turning lock to left. You had better believe he has OBVIOUS, right sway on the spin turn, just as Jonthan and I suggested was the usual practice. And then on the turning lock (to LEFT), he sways to the left.

In fact, Hilton has MORE sway on that spin turn that he does on some of his naturals, many of which he chose in that particular dance to perform in a very vertical non-sway manner.