Log In

Username:

Password:

   Stay logged in?

Forgot Password?

User Status

 

Attention

 

Recover Password

Username or Email:

Loading...
Change Image
Enter the code in the photo at left:

Before We Continue...

Are you absolutely sure you want
to delete this message?

Premium Membership

Upgrade to
Premium Membership!

Renew Your
Premium Membership!

$99
$79
PER YEAR

Premium Membership includes the following benefits:

Don't let your Premium Membership expire, or you'll miss out on:

  • Exclusive access to over 1,400 video demonstrations of patterns in the full bronze, silver and gold levels.
  • Access to all previous variations of the week, including full video instruction of man's and lady's parts.
  • Over twice as many videos as basic membership.
  • A completely ad-free experience!

 

Sponsored Ad

+ View Older Messages

Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by terence2
1/22/2008  11:43:00 PM
I think the literal translation of "BR" , can only be translated by the world of mystics !

The term was intended to show, that if the knees are flexed ( which they frequently are ) then the gradual straightening of that apendage should be absorbed in continuity, with the rise designated thru the feet .

Bad explanation = bad results .


But your point is well taken .
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Serendipidy
1/23/2008  4:40:00 AM
I don't think to use the words straightening of the legs as correct. Straightening of the knees yes. My legs are straight and dont need straightening. Its the knees that bend and straighten. The rise is through the feet and the knees as well as in the lowering.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by anymouse
1/23/2008  7:03:00 AM
"'Body rise', if you interpret it literally CANNOT exist because, as you will soon notice if you stand in front of a mirror, it is impossible to lengthen the region of your spine from your coccyx to your skull short of lying down for 8 hours sleep (which apparently makes you grow about 1 cm or so, which gravity then robs back off you throughout the day as your spine recompresses), going into zero-gravity for a while (same principal) or perhaps the employment of some sort of medieval torture device such as the rack! The best you will manage, if you try, will be to shrug your shoulders (which is clearly not what is intended). Given the impracticalities of the formerly mentioned techniques during a bar of even the slowest foxtrot, then if you think logically about it, it can't have anything to do with your body or trunk as the name suggests."

This is not entirely true. Very few people habitually carry their spine aligned for maximum height, and encouraging students in that direction is very common habit of dance teachers.

It is true that the "mind game" effect on presence and performance is greater than they physical increase in height, but the increase in height is not zero.

This even applies, slightly, to body rise as a variable dance element. For example, the middle step of a lady's feather has no foot rise, but a lot of body rise - she need to be as tall as she possibly can be during the phase in which her weight is on her standing heel, because that's a point in time when her partner actually will have foot rise. Most of that is going to be in the leg (hopefully stopping just short of a locked knee), but some of it is going to be in keeping the trunk as aligned, and thus as tall, as humanly possible - and then some.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Dave
1/23/2008  7:49:00 AM
Body rise could be thought of the swinging of the body up. There is more to swing than just foot rise and leg rise. There is the power and weight of the swinging foot and the power of the arms and shoulders and the varies muscles of the body that come into play. The body rise(upward flight) of a professional is far greater than that of a novice.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Serendipidy
1/23/2008  3:57:00 PM
I will put this on once again. At a lecture by Steven Hillier he said When I rise my body stays down. And when I lower my body stays up. It is all done through the feet ankles and knees.
An excellent excercise to duplicate this to stand by yourself against a door on your toes with the back touching the surface of the door, Lower through the feet ( keeping the heel of one foot from making contact with the floor ) As the heel touches the floor the knees will bend so that the angle between the feet and the knee is 45 degrees and the same between the knee to the hip. Now of course rise with the feet then the knees in that order. A question to ask oneself is what is the angle of the foot from toe to heel in relation to the legs when fully risen. And how many times will the knees bend in three beats of music in the Waltz.
The lady or whoever is going backwards in the Foxtrot. I don't know what you think but I think with the Sway that is required is all that is needed in the way of body rise to complement the man's steps and technique.
I would just like to add this. You never know how far you can go in ballroom dancing. The winners yesterday of the Professional Rising Stars Latin at the UK Championships. They were also winners at the German Championship. Five years ago they were doing Rumba Walks around and around this hall every Sunday with the rest of us untill they moved to the UK. I used to get directly behind Julian and Melanie hoping their talent might rub off on me. Keep trying you just never know
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by anymouse
1/23/2008  5:03:00 PM
"I will put this on once again. At a lecture by Steven Hillier he said When I rise my body stays down. And when I lower my body stays up. It is all done through the feet ankles and knees."

On the contrary, the point of that lecture is that it is *not* all done through the feet and legs. There's a determined effort to lengthen the body, especially when lowering in the feet and legs - the actual change may be small, but the intent is important. It's not enough to go to the lecture, you actually have to schedule lessons with these teachers if you want to have a hope of really understanding them.

"As the heel touches the floor the knees will bend so that the angle between the feet and the knee is 45 degrees"

45 degrees might be the right answer for some situations, but it is the WRONG answer for others. Are you ever going to realize that dancing is all about context, or are you just going to go on repeating lecture trivia forever?

"A question to ask oneself is what is the angle of the foot from toe to heel in relation to the legs when fully risen."

For what application? For what dancer? For man or for lady? In what shoes? Context sir, context!
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Serendipidy
1/23/2008  5:58:00 PM
We are discussing I think a Waltz and to duplicate the action we will be doing if we are doing the rise and the fall in the Modern Waltz against a door. I am in bare feet. You can be in high heels. I believe the angle would be the same in both cases but obviously not at the start.. Also over the three beats of music there will be from straight to bent knees twice. Thats why its a good idea to get against that door and go for it. Thats a lot of flexing of the knees, about 42 times if we are on the floor for 1.5 minutes
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by anymouse
1/23/2008  8:08:00 PM
"We are discussing I think a Waltz and to duplicate the action we will be doing if we are doing the rise and the fall in the Modern Waltz against a door. I am in bare feet. You can be in high heels. I believe the angle would be the same in both cases but obviously not at the start."

Then you obviuosly haven't really thought about it. Who is dancing? How strong are they? How stiff is the toe box of the shoe? Are they demonstrating, competing, social dancing, practicing? What tempo is the music? How big is the room? Is the floor crowded? What do they wish to communicate?

"Also over the three beats of music there will be from straight to bent knees twice."

Or once, or three times, or none at all. It all depends on the proportions of movement appropriate for the dancing that is to be done. As an obvious example, many dancers, from beginner through world finalist, will (for differing reasons) at times quite correctly not achieve fully straight legs in the three-to-one transition. In other situations they may achieve them not only there, but between one and two, flex somewhat, and then straighten again at the peak of the rise. Many possibilities that are correct, even for the same figure, all depending on the situation.

The key skill is not to memorize answers (since those will be wrong as often as they are right) but to understand why the answer for a specific case is what it is, and why the answer for a slightly different case - even of the same figure - would have to be different.
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by Serendipidy
1/24/2008  5:50:00 AM
None of the technique books are directed to Social Dancers. So I would say you can remove the crowded floor syndrome Or a Waltz that is not played at the correct tempo. Or how strong the dancer is. The dancer has to fit the bill it is not the other way around. Who can think of a better excercise for strengthening the feet and ankles than to do the suggested against a door. And does it or does it not come near to the action we use in the Modern Waltz
Re: Leg Rise vs. Foot Rise
Posted by phil.samways
1/24/2008  6:18:00 AM
"""At a lecture by Steven Hillier he said When I rise my body stays down. And when I lower my body stays up. """
I've heard this many times. Probably Stephen Hillier was the original source. He is an excellent teacher.
It would be great to ask Stephen Hillier to expand on the quote.
Next time you sit in a chair (which obviously uses some lowering action with the legs) check your posture. Everyone i watch slumps a little as they sit down. This doesn't look good. One excellent way to prevent it is to 'think' up as you sit down. It's a thought picture. And an excellent one. Not to be taken absolutely literally.
Similarly, when you rise, don't strain every sinew in your body to get your head onto the ceiling. This looks unpleasant too.
If only i could remember this when i'm competing.....

+ View More Messages

Copyright  ©  1997-2017 BallroomDancers.com
Loading...