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Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by Polished
10/28/2008  2:39:00 PM
Augusto Schiavo former World and British Amateur and Professional Champion was invited to deliver a lecture at the IDSF Congress to be held in California.Two days before the event he was uninvited. His crime was he adjudicated an event which was not sactioned by the IDSF.
Are the IDSF ruining our dance world. Do they have the right to dictate who we can and cannot work for ??
All of the above is reported on Dancesport UK along with a lot of other strong reports and comments.
The tactics being used after the court case in Holland is to pressure the different affiliated Societies to do their dirty work. If any of this appears to be not correct please criticize
Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by Polished
10/20/2008  4:39:00 PM
What does an Open Event mean to you.It should mean completely Open to all.But most of the competitions are restricted, you have to be a paid up member of a Dance Society to be accepted. Blackpool is completely Open. Any of us can enter no matter where we belong. Is that a good thing or is it bad.
I was talking to one guy who thought that Open meant a grade just one above A Grade. How wrong was that.
In USADance competitions, Open means beyond syllab
Posted by jofjonesboro
10/20/2008  5:54:00 PM
I don't know what 'A Grade' means.

In the US, syllabus competition is divided into levels defined by 'difficulty': Bronze, Silver and Gold.

Open competition is supposedly 'above' Gold because it allows figures that are not included in the syllabus.

There are pro/pro and pro/am competitions in the US that call themselves "open" but participation still requires membership in some organization, usually the NDCA.


Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by terence2
10/21/2008  5:03:00 AM
Open has become a dual meaning.

it now implies one of 2 things.. open in the " you " are all invited" sense..or.. you may dance any figures you choose ,No restrictions .

Open and closed was originally designated to serve as a distinction in a geographical sense as in " Country " .The classic e.g. of this was when Frank Regan won the Canadian and US latin and Standard Champ . ( he,s actually from scotland ) the US the following yr made it a closed comp. !
Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by Polished
10/21/2008  1:06:00 AM
jofjonesboro. I suppose it depends on where you live. Before Dancesport was formed we had grades from E, thats the lowest, to A which was the highest. To elevate it took a certain amount of wins to go up a grade. Since Dancesport was formed the grades are 1 to 5. Somehow in their infinite wisdom grade 5 was made the highest, and grade 1 is the lowest. But as Romeo said to Juliet. A Rose is still a Rose. It doesn`t matter what other name it is given it is still a Rose as is the name of the grades.
We don`t have Medal Competitions here which is a pity.
Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by anymouse
10/21/2008  7:53:00 AM
open telemark
open reverse
open choreography
open entry

Each a different meaning of 'open', and each a meaning that is well established and correct.
Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by terence2
10/21/2008  8:37:00 AM
Open here
Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by jofjonesboro
10/21/2008  8:48:00 AM
What does an Open Event mean to you (sic).

Polished set the parameters of the discussion quite clearly - for a change.

Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by Polished
10/21/2008  1:28:00 PM
An Open Event should mean that anybody can enter. Any competition organized by the WDC is completely Open. All of the IDSF competitions are restricted and not only that if you were to compete next month at Disney Land in Paris you will be victimised. This they have put in writting as a warning.
" A statement issued by the WDC says.
The present turmoil in global dance politics will only worsen whilst the current course is followed. The dance market is not of sufficient scale to sustain such internal antagonism ".
Truer words were never written.
Posted by jofjonesboro
10/21/2008  1:57:00 PM
"'. . . . The dance market is not of sufficient scale to sustain such internal antagonism'".

In prowling around through the websites of various ballroom-dance organizations, I was struck by so many vicious admonitions against participating in the "wrong" activities.

Ballroom dancing is probably enjoying as much popularity right now as it ever has and yet it still affects only a small percentage of the overall population, especially in the US.

It's truly sad to see the various elements of the ballroom-dance industry fighting over what limited economies there are in this activity, like wild animals fighting over a carcass.

Re: Truer words were never written.
Posted by Polished
10/21/2008  2:16:00 PM
This to most will be news. The IDSF an Amatuer body started a Professional Section. So the WDC a Professional body have introduces an Amatuer Section. Which to me seems fair enough. The WDC events have no restrictions, meaning it is completely Open to anyone. The same cannot be said about the other group who have issued a list of current competitions that YOU are not allowed to take part in. Judges included.
On the horizon there is a war looming.
Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by anymouse
10/21/2008  8:09:00 PM
"Any competition organized by the WDC is completely Open."

Perhaps those organized by the WDC itself, but most "WDC" competitions are organized by its national member bodies, and many of those are not open. You still must hold an appropriate membership card to enter.

You might think they are a bit better than the IDSF in that they don't threaten to revoke your membership card if you dance elsewhere. But that's only true for amateurs and they don't have many amateur events. If you dance in an IDSF pro events, Donnie has threatened to declare you to be an amateur again. WDC does have lots of pro events, so they protect those.

In the end they are both the same - they make threats to protect what they have, and then turn around and claim to be in favor of free choice in the area where they don't yet have much of a presence to loose to "fair" competition.
Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by Polished
10/22/2008  3:51:00 PM
The most prodigious Dance Championships in the world is the British at Blackpool. Whether you are an Amatuer or Professional you can enter. Who knows what happend with the Dutch Championship last year which is also open. Did the IDSF have to back down and give an undertaking that they would not bring sactions against any Amatuer who took part. Was this a ruling given by a judge in court. But this was in Holland. The disturbing thing was at that time it was being rumoured , watch out Blackpool and others. If anybody feels that any of the above is not correct please feel free to contadict. But first go to the WDC and the IDSF web sites.
Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by jacobuserasmus
10/23/2008  6:44:00 AM
The ugly world of Ballroom and Latin competitions

I was all excited when I heard about the IDSF and then first thing that happens is I read the rules and there we go you are not allowed to dance competitions.

Wait let me say this again the IDSF have a rule that you are not allowed to dance competitions. Can someone point me to any other sport where there is such a rule ?

I accept the fact like in all my other sports that I need to be a member to compete in their competition in most other sports this is the case (Running, Cycling, Swimming, Tri-athlon it's called a license). Paying a simple yearly fee and temporary licenses to handle non permanent members.

Some of these organizations even request that we do not do competitions that is not sanctioned. But at the end of the day the only organization that actually forbid you and actively sanction you is the IDSF. Why ?

Is it not enough that you do not receive points when competing in a non sanctioned event ?

I can only speak for my only country FEDANSA being the official IDSF body. There is some rules that is very good and some that are just stupid the one about not competing in a non sanctioned event is just stupid. Also the distinction in dance between professional and amateur aaaahhhh ...

Re: Open.Lets use the word correctly
Posted by Polished
10/23/2008  2:57:00 PM
Jacob. Its all about money. If you want a competition to be ratified then you have to pay. A person I know of for years ran a competition. He put up the money and took the risk and hopefully made a profit. Then everything changed. To be ratified he had to pay a percentage of his profit. He no longer runs a competition.
How much easier it was in the old days. There was a healthy rivalry between the different dance societies but there was no hard and fast rule as to which competition you could or could not enter. We didn`t pay any annual fees and most smaller comps we entered and paid at the door and there collected our back number.
But today to tell a judge who he can and can`t work for without being victimised. I doubt if it would stand up in a court of law.
This I have just copied from the ISDF web site.
Unregistered Events.
WDC Paris Dec 5_7 Called the Open World
Ballroom and Latin
Also THe Dutch Open Assen Nov 13_ 16
The Presidium may take action against any athelete , adjudicator or other official. person or body associated with IDSF or any member who participates in this competition in any way without any further notice to any of them.
This warning as above is repeated after each banned event.
I`ll leave it there
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