"The whisk first appeared in the 4th edition and its description, together with a suggested follow of a chasse based on the quickstep chasse remained largely unchanged through to the 9th edition."

In which case the specifics of dancing the figure from a promenade beginning may not have been given much attention, since the progressive chasse in quickstep is not in promenade.

What is very interesting is that the present description of the chasse from promenade seems to be the only place where specific instruction on how to execute a promenade is given - everything else is descriptive, but this is really the only instruction provided.

It is also quite evident that "body" in the context of this note is not quite the same meaning as "body" in the context of the chart descriptions - in the note, it clearly refers to the upper body, and in the chart the orientation given is clearly that of the lower. The opposite assignments simply would not be physically possible within a closed hold.

Ultimately, I suspect that the non-instructive (and to many, serverly misleading) description of promenade to be found in glossaries is something inherited by the described technique rather than truly part of it - it predates the codification of the type of dancing described in the books, because it's obviously somethwat incosistent with actual closed hold execution. Further, it's quite obvious that if something is turned out this must be primarily the lower body, as again turning out the upper body is not possible while remaining in what was coming to be understood as closed hold.

Clive Harrison . Not odd at all. If you go into a Chair after the Chasse. There are dozens of moves that can be done from a Chasse that finishes in P.P.. William Pino does one where he crosses behind with the right foot and goes into a Lunge to the right. He must like the move . On my Blackpool tape he does it three times in 12 bars of Waltz.
Concerning some of the other writing.Obviously somebody is quoting a Chasse to the right and trying to pass the body alignments off as a chasse to the left.

No, I was quoting YOUR hero Moore on the Chasse from PP following a Whisk. If you can't see the irony of NOT turning square if you are going to dance the whole Chasse IN PP, rather than FROM PP (ie, that in order to turn square, you have to have been NOT square), then you are a bigger fool than I took you for.

"Obviously somebody is quoting a Chasse to the right and trying to pass the body alignments off as a chasse to the left."

No.

The referenced note (body square to wall despite feet being DW) is in the description of the chasse from promenade in the waltz section.

Anonymous. " NO ". Is that what you wrote.Does that mean there is a reference to the body being square. I think you will find that the only reference to being square is for the lady and that means square to the partner and not the wall as her RF closes to the LF.
The Progressive Chasse to the right is a different story. In this case in the book it starts Diag to centre for the man and it does say backing wall and backing diag to wall on steps 2 and 3.
So exactly where does " NO " fit in.
This is now Waltz remember which is a long way from Tango.
To get back to the original question which was.Do you agree that at the end of the Progressive Link or Brush Tap you should be with your feet both man and lady in a closed position. Yes.
If you go to the chart where in this case the man and the ladies steps are in the same diagram. page 245 The Closed Promenade. At the beginning and at the end the feet are in a closed position. I think that says it all taking into consideration that it is preceeded by a Progressive Link.
On the charts each square is to scale representing 2' by 2' Does anyone want to get a ruler out and work out how close to each other the man and the ladies feet are. I don't think even blind Freddie would say it is supposed to start off in an open position.

"Does that mean there is a reference to the body being square."

Exactly, in the description of the chasse from promenade it says the body should be practically square to the wall the whole time, despite the chart showing that the feet are in other alignments.

This specifically points out the flaw in your argument from the whisk and chasse thread - you feel that the man's body should match the foot alignments throughout, but he we have a specific comment in the book that the body does not match what is given as the foot alignment, but is instead square to the wall throughout.

"I think you will find that the only reference to being square is for the lady"

You would be wrong. The note is given for both partners.

"and that means square to the partner and not the wall"

You would be wrong. It says square to the wall. Since it says this for both partners, it is implicit that they will be square to each other.

"as her RF closes to the LF."

You would be wrong. The note says throughout.

"The Progressive Chasse to the right is a different story."

The chasse to right is not a promenade figure, and is not the subject of this discussion or the referenced note, which is written specifically about the CHASSE FROM PROMENADE.

"Do you agree that at the end of the Progressive Link or Brush Tap you should be with your feet both man and lady in a closed position. Yes."

I've repeatedly stated that the progressive link, AND EVERY OTHER PROMENADE, is to be executed in as closed a position as possible. The alignment of the feet will, of course be that of promenade as the book clearly states that this is a promenade position.

It's quite interesting to see whether it is just the Ballroom world that says one thing about PP, but does another (as it has been suggested), and to look at the equivalent in the Latin style.

Laird also refers to PP (as it applies to Samba, Jive and Paso Doble). And guess what: we have a virtually identical description. Take a look. And tell me (again) that I'm mistaken.

"It's quite interesting to see whether it is just the Ballroom world that says one thing about PP, but does another (as it has been suggested), and to look at the equivalent in the Latin style.

Laird also refers to PP (as it applies to Samba, Jive and Paso Doble). And guess what: we have a virtually identical description. Take a look. And tell me (again) that I'm mistaken."

When you are not trying to maintain a standard closed hold's arm line, you can turn the body into non-parallel positions without spoiling the hold. Consider for a minute a Jive chasse danced with the joined hands lowered - now you can open into a bit of a V, which would require lowering the hands, since you've already decided not to keep them up.

In effect, latin provides the illustrative example of how you would have to alter the hold in order to make a non-parallel promenade type position clean. Since you can't alter the hold in standard, you must keep your promenades parallel.

"When the man's right and lady's left sides are in contact with the opposite sides of the body turned out to form a V. The feet will normally match the turning out of the body." Now, WHAT position can this be, and who says so?

Chris Hawkins lectured on waltz at Blackpool this year and included some discussion and demonstration of good and bad promenades. He and Justyna were certainly not parallel when in PP. They were not open at 90 degress either but were very definitely open.

But! They were also much wider in their normal hold than would be appropriate for the social dancefloor and Justyna's poise was much farther back than a typical social dancer. This bigger top line means that the difference between closed and promenade positions is less obvious and the "opening" to PP is achieved easily by a slight rotation to move the lady towards the man's right hip together with the change of lady's head line. There is no need to change the hold, it just breathes slightly.

Outside the competition or show arena the more typically compact top line means that the turn out to PP is more pronounced and can lead to an ugly right arm and shoulder for the man. However in this case the dance police are unlikely to punish a slight adjustment to the hold.