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Correct following
Posted by Joyce
11/5/2010  4:13:00 PM
Our group dance instructor teaching the waltz at the local senior center says that the lady should stand straight and lean back against the man's hand on her back.

I have looked at the information on this web site about the weight connection, and don't understand how I can push against the man when he pushes and still push back against his hand.

Please explain.
Re: Correct following
Posted by Bewildered
11/5/2010  5:05:00 PM
Sack the Instructor immediately.
Re: Correct following
Posted by dheun
11/5/2010  9:29:00 PM
Try not to confuse "lean back" with "push back."
You can lean against something without pushing at all. Your instructor is probably just wanting to make sure you are not leaning forward or hunching your shoulders. The info on this website about the connection and how it should feel like a slight push for the man and a push/resistance for the lady is exactly correct -- and it's one of the more important feelings to dancing that you should try to master. But yes, it should also feel like you are leaning against the man's hand on your back -- because to not do so means you are not holding frame. Plus, it will be much easier to feel the lead in your back. As you get more experienced, that's where you'll feel the lead, more so than through the hands. The best advice might be, that once you get more experienced, you'll be "leaning back against the man's hand on your back" automatically, without even wondering about what it means. Pushing slightly forward with your hands/arms to create the proper resistance automatically should "push" or lean your back toward the man's hand on your back. Actually quite hard, and awkward, to do otherwise.
Re: Correct following
Posted by terence2
11/7/2010  12:41:00 AM

I think we may have a bit of a disagreement here.

If I EVER have any of my Amat. ( or Pro couples ) PUSH, then I will push them out of the door !!!.The choice of word ,is a bit too extreme and in all probability, will create other issues.

"Resistance " in "hold " is created thru body contact with the correct alignment and correct weight distribution over the standing leg/foot.

Pressure applied thru the mans right arm/hand stabilises the contact .

The left hand,man, and right hand lady,maintain contact thru very slight pressure, brought to bear thru the base of the hands( Its NOT a pushing match ! )
The positioning of the head, may also afffect weight and balance if incorrectly used and or placed .

To the poster. In a class, you are usually not going to receive the correct info. from a partnership standpoint ( unless its of a very high level ). In addition, if you are in a mixed group of singles, then a compatability issue may arise.

And , Please DONT lean !!.Let the natural curves in the body do their work .
Re: Correct following
Posted by dheun
11/6/2010  12:33:00 PM
Once again, I agree with Terence. I don't particularly like the term "push," though it is readily understandable when showing someone that you don't mean a push in the true sense of the word. But it is a little easier for a beginner to understand the resistance concept when you tell them it is slight push, or signal.
But it's also good to explain that you should feel that resistance in such a way that someone looking at you could not even tell that there was a feeling of resistance being established ... because you look to be just standing still. That's what you are talking about with it being created through proper body connection and correct weight, etc.
But yes, push is not the best word because it means different things to different people.
Re: Correct following
Posted by Joyce
11/7/2010  7:39:00 AM
When we practice to music, one of my partners said I was back leading. What is that?
It is not good.
Posted by jofjonesboro
11/7/2010  9:56:00 AM
"Backleading" means leading from the follow position. In other words, you're trying to direct what he does instead of letting him direct your actions. You're executing your movements without waiting for his lead and thus trying to take charge of floorcraft.

Backleading is a symptom of poor instruction. It's typical when a woman has tried to learn to dance by doing routines. As a result, she doesn't understand how to follow.

I have fired instructors for backleading me in a lesson and I will not tolerate any partner who does so.

jj

PS I'm sorry if this response seems a little harsh but I fully understand that partner's complaint. You'll enjoy dancing much more when you can break yourself of the habit. Following, like leading, is an art unto itself.
Re: Correct following
Posted by cbmp
11/7/2010  11:39:00 AM
Correct following requires listening from a kinesthetic point of view. That is why pushing, backleading, and the like, are the very opposite of what leaders and followers should be doing.

The leader indicates the direction of movement, the follower moves in that direction, and the leader follows the follower. Not as contradictory as it may seem.

In Tai Chi, there is a concept of "Lu," which is about drawing energy inwards. This requires listening to a partner's energy. Ballroom technique and Tai Chi technique have many similarities, as do all techniques of efficient movement. I believe jj has pointed out several times the connection between these two arts.
Re: Correct following
Posted by terence2
11/8/2010  12:03:00 AM
" Back leading " is frequently, and primarily caused, by transfering the weight too quickly, and lowering to the heel of the supporting leg , in turn,becoming back weighted.
Re: Correct following
Posted by dheun
11/8/2010  7:08:00 AM
Just the word "backleading" sends shivers down my spine. If a partner tries to backlead on me, I will just ask them to try to follow the lead. And then avoid dancing with them again.
In a social setting, it's fine, though annoying. Some women have never danced with someone who can lead, so they don't know any better. But there is no way you can look good as a dance couple if the woman insists on backleading. When I am teaching, or am at a lesson, a man might say, "She's trying to lead." And the woman will say, "He's not leading, I don't feel anything." That means they need to start from scratch and learn about the resistance and connection that is needed. Jofjonesboro once said on this message board that a good connection should make one feel as if they are steering a bicycle in leading the woman through the dances. I have used that analogy often, because it is true and it is a concept people can grasp. Stop your backleading now before it is too late! Follow the lead, and learn how it feels to do so.

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